b-body-bob
Well-known member
Yeah but on the bright side you can turn around and sell it for $50. Including shipping.
Rusty's not very quiet cuda progress
- Thread starter mopar_man
- Start date
RUSTY Cuda
In over my head!
well I cleaned it up & painted the darn thing should be worth at least a grand now!!!!!!
gonna see if I can round up enough hardware to get started, I have no Idea where that stuff walks off to?
gonna see if I can round up enough hardware to get started, I have no Idea where that stuff walks off to?
b-body-bob
Well-known member
I got a whole bag of assorted hardware with the Duster, and hardly used any of it. I just accepted that I'd be way ahead to just buy hardware kits from the get-go.
RUSTY Cuda
In over my head!
I bought quite a few sets for the other car, disappointing to say the least, the fender U-nuts stripped out instantly, rear valance kit had about half the wrong parts & so on.
I also bought a ton of used parts that came with hardware, now this car came to me with a lot missing, I was actually thinking of going back to the original pics to check out my problem areas.
With all that I still seem to come up short, next post is my scrounge up front end parts.
I also bought a ton of used parts that came with hardware, now this car came to me with a lot missing, I was actually thinking of going back to the original pics to check out my problem areas.
With all that I still seem to come up short, next post is my scrounge up front end parts.
RUSTY Cuda
In over my head!
First I pulled out the headlight box, when I got to the bottom I found a better set of parking light covers, gotta dig deeper before I pit stuff together!
I was missing 4 of the u-nuts for the bezels on the grille, on the top 2 holes regular ones would fit, but the bottom was shorter, there was one in there but it had different threads, so I ground down a couple of the others! top other, middle ground down & bottom was the wrong one that was in there.
So I go to put them on & find one screw fell right through the hole, reverted back to one I had repaired, gotta see if I can fix the other it was much better? 
All my bags laid out, extra rear valance leftovers provided a bunch of the u-nuts!
Marks bolt collection provided 1 orig type rusty bolt & some new ones if I have too, my bolt collection provided 4 more, so I should have enough now to do the grille & the lower valance. whew!
I was missing 4 of the u-nuts for the bezels on the grille, on the top 2 holes regular ones would fit, but the bottom was shorter, there was one in there but it had different threads, so I ground down a couple of the others! top other, middle ground down & bottom was the wrong one that was in there.
So I go to put them on & find one screw fell right through the hole, reverted back to one I had repaired, gotta see if I can fix the other it was much better? All my bags laid out, extra rear valance leftovers provided a bunch of the u-nuts!
Marks bolt collection provided 1 orig type rusty bolt & some new ones if I have too, my bolt collection provided 4 more, so I should have enough now to do the grille & the lower valance. whew!
RUSTY Cuda
In over my head!
OK , quiz time, On the header panel it has 5 spots to connect the grille, outers slide in, 
But the middle one is a square hole & I couldn't get it to pop in there, am I missing a welded in nut there, I don't think it's accessible for a nut & bolt?
Next question, does the heater control come out the front so I can mount the cable & put it back in, I looked under there & it looks near impossible to do with it installed?
I was thinking bout trying to fix the old & then just said screw it buy a new one!
But the middle one is a square hole & I couldn't get it to pop in there, am I missing a welded in nut there, I don't think it's accessible for a nut & bolt?Next question, does the heater control come out the front so I can mount the cable & put it back in, I looked under there & it looks near impossible to do with it installed?
I was thinking bout trying to fix the old & then just said screw it buy a new one!
RUSTY Cuda
In over my head!
These were in my grille bag, they look like paint can lid locks, are they for anything on the grille? 
b-body-bob
Well-known member
RUSTY Cuda
In over my head!
cool that might work, I can steal one off the front plate mount that's sitting right there to test it!
RUSTY Cuda
In over my head!
Got lucky when I was setting up for the headlights I had an extra plastic for the adjusters & it snapped in that square hole on the header panel, wrong type & much larger screw to screw with the rivet counters!
Putting the insert into the lower valance was a challenge it didn't even come close to the mounting points, I even brought out the new one in hopes it would fit better, well middle was the same & the curved edges were worse.
the 3 points it had tabs to go to the metal mounting points were about 3/4" away from the metal, the corners bent up at least a 1/2"
I put long bolts in the 2 end holes & brought them to about 1/4" away, the middle I squeezed a little & it cracked the back of the insert, so I just skipped that one, on the corners I very gingerly put a screw through as I held it down, then just snugged them till they touched the metal.
How long before they fall out I have no idea.
I do love the front of these cars!
I will defiantly need to mount that bumper filler!
Putting the insert into the lower valance was a challenge it didn't even come close to the mounting points, I even brought out the new one in hopes it would fit better, well middle was the same & the curved edges were worse.
the 3 points it had tabs to go to the metal mounting points were about 3/4" away from the metal, the corners bent up at least a 1/2"
I put long bolts in the 2 end holes & brought them to about 1/4" away, the middle I squeezed a little & it cracked the back of the insert, so I just skipped that one, on the corners I very gingerly put a screw through as I held it down, then just snugged them till they touched the metal.
How long before they fall out I have no idea.
I do love the front of these cars!
I will defiantly need to mount that bumper filler!
Dr.Jass
Pastor of Muppets
Playing catch-up here... I was going to respond that you must have the bumper filler panel with the '73-up bumper mounts, but you've already discovered that. 
Unfortunately, there's no diagram of the filler in the parts book. I found the part number but that was essentially a wild stab in the dark on which I lucked out.
The gap in the bumper looks really wide at the driver's side end. Is that an optical delusion, or a reproduction bumper?
Those paint-lid retainers kind of look like headliner clips, but I'm not 100% sure. Chrysler used similar retainers in a number of places on cars of that era. Some heater boxes were held together with those. Speaking of the heater, I've not disassembled an AC model yet (my current Challenger was apart when I got it) but the service manual makes it sound pretty easy:
Unfortunately, there's no diagram of the filler in the parts book. I found the part number but that was essentially a wild stab in the dark on which I lucked out.The gap in the bumper looks really wide at the driver's side end. Is that an optical delusion, or a reproduction bumper?
Those paint-lid retainers kind of look like headliner clips, but I'm not 100% sure. Chrysler used similar retainers in a number of places on cars of that era. Some heater boxes were held together with those. Speaking of the heater, I've not disassembled an AC model yet (my current Challenger was apart when I got it) but the service manual makes it sound pretty easy:
RUSTY Cuda
In over my head!
Hmmm, I think that's the wrong cable instructions. it sounds like the one on the heat only 73 I did?
This is the cable that goes out the firewall to the heater valve, it has a screw in retainer at the control (that plastic flap) & there's a clip on the heater valve you press the cable into.
I'm hoping the control comes out the front so I can put the cable on in front of the dash & then slide the whole thing back in, doing it installed looks near impossible, but I have not tried yet!
Didn't measure the gaps, there's some adjustment in the brackets?
I was thinking of moving the brackets back, but that would involve a ton of work on pretty heavy metal, I will attempt installing the filler, I better not mess up that pristine grille, I will burn the damn car if that happens!
How do self tapping screws work on plastic, I will do a test someplace that won't show, if they work my worst problem will be getting the deformed ends to look decent, if not I have a ton of drilling & tapping to do!
I do remember similar clips on the heater box, but these were in the grille hardware bag?
A/C heater box was a touch more work rebuilding then heat only but not bad.
Speaking of which I have a whole set of A/C box firewall gaskets to send you, they came in both kits I bought firewall & box, but if your buying the kits, you'll have extras too?
I will put those clips in the headliner bag, when I get it done in the spring that guy will know.
This is the cable that goes out the firewall to the heater valve, it has a screw in retainer at the control (that plastic flap) & there's a clip on the heater valve you press the cable into.
I'm hoping the control comes out the front so I can put the cable on in front of the dash & then slide the whole thing back in, doing it installed looks near impossible, but I have not tried yet!
Didn't measure the gaps, there's some adjustment in the brackets?
I was thinking of moving the brackets back, but that would involve a ton of work on pretty heavy metal, I will attempt installing the filler, I better not mess up that pristine grille, I will burn the damn car if that happens!
How do self tapping screws work on plastic, I will do a test someplace that won't show, if they work my worst problem will be getting the deformed ends to look decent, if not I have a ton of drilling & tapping to do!
I do remember similar clips on the heater box, but these were in the grille hardware bag?
A/C heater box was a touch more work rebuilding then heat only but not bad.
Speaking of which I have a whole set of A/C box firewall gaskets to send you, they came in both kits I bought firewall & box, but if your buying the kits, you'll have extras too?
I will put those clips in the headliner bag, when I get it done in the spring that guy will know.
Last edited:
Dr.Jass
Pastor of Muppets
I'm not sure on the cable thing, but it's the only thing I found in the service manual and it was under "AC". That means very little, of course.
On the bumper, the passenger's-side gap looks perfect along its length (from the center peak to the outside edge) but the gap looks wider at the outside edge on the driver's side than at the peak. That may be a "persepective" issue because of camera angle, though. Regardless, adjusting either bracket to fix a gap issue on one side would create a gap issue on the other. If indeed there's a gap disparity, the best you'd be able to do is average them so they're the same on both sides.
If you're going to attempt self-tappers to hold the filler to the grille, get self-drilling screws. The factory screws were most likely Philips truss head, but being invisible it's probably not critical. Drill pilot holes first anyway--1/16" or thereabout, depending on the screw size. Do not use power tools to install the screws. That plastic is very unforgiving--you will break it. Use a screwdriver (Philips) or nut runner (hex head--looks like a screwdriver but has a socket on the end) to install the screw, being patient to let the screw tip do its thing. Again, that plastic shatters if you look at it wrong, so take your time and let the tools do the work! If you don't have the proper size nut runner or a screwdriver that fits the fastener perfectly, go get one at the hardware store (and shame on you for not having a #0 or #1 screwdriver in the case of the latter). It'll be less than $10, but even if it's $100 it's cheaper than finding another grille!
Before you drill or screw anything: Is it possible those "headliner/heater box" retainers were used to secure the filler to the grille? Look for marks along its length that match up to the fangs on, or size of, the clips.
On the bumper, the passenger's-side gap looks perfect along its length (from the center peak to the outside edge) but the gap looks wider at the outside edge on the driver's side than at the peak. That may be a "persepective" issue because of camera angle, though. Regardless, adjusting either bracket to fix a gap issue on one side would create a gap issue on the other. If indeed there's a gap disparity, the best you'd be able to do is average them so they're the same on both sides.
If you're going to attempt self-tappers to hold the filler to the grille, get self-drilling screws. The factory screws were most likely Philips truss head, but being invisible it's probably not critical. Drill pilot holes first anyway--1/16" or thereabout, depending on the screw size. Do not use power tools to install the screws. That plastic is very unforgiving--you will break it. Use a screwdriver (Philips) or nut runner (hex head--looks like a screwdriver but has a socket on the end) to install the screw, being patient to let the screw tip do its thing. Again, that plastic shatters if you look at it wrong, so take your time and let the tools do the work! If you don't have the proper size nut runner or a screwdriver that fits the fastener perfectly, go get one at the hardware store (and shame on you for not having a #0 or #1 screwdriver in the case of the latter). It'll be less than $10, but even if it's $100 it's cheaper than finding another grille!
Before you drill or screw anything: Is it possible those "headliner/heater box" retainers were used to secure the filler to the grille? Look for marks along its length that match up to the fangs on, or size of, the clips.
RUSTY Cuda
In over my head!
OK, gaps I'll check, today would have been nice out there but the grandkids take precedence!
The screws I have are called bit tip, from my sheet metal days, I just worried when it catches the threads it might split the plastic?
they are only 3/4" long, I'll test the bottom (hidden) spot first.
I have no idea about #1 or #0 screwdrivers, but I have a bunch & a set of nut drivers or my mini socket set has a driver handle.
If I drill em I could just use my regular sheet metal screws, pointy tip & slightly wider thread size.
The phillips that came with the cowl screen set were basically bit tips, look just like mine, but mine are 1/4" heads & a little longer.
I will go SLOW & be super careful I DO NOT want to damage that grille it was the better of the 2 & I saved it for this car!
The screws I have are called bit tip, from my sheet metal days, I just worried when it catches the threads it might split the plastic?
they are only 3/4" long, I'll test the bottom (hidden) spot first.
I have no idea about #1 or #0 screwdrivers, but I have a bunch & a set of nut drivers or my mini socket set has a driver handle.
If I drill em I could just use my regular sheet metal screws, pointy tip & slightly wider thread size.
The phillips that came with the cowl screen set were basically bit tips, look just like mine, but mine are 1/4" heads & a little longer.
I will go SLOW & be super careful I DO NOT want to damage that grille it was the better of the 2 & I saved it for this car!
Dr.Jass
Pastor of Muppets
Make sure to check for evidentiary marks on the filler panel to see if those clips are how it was retained. It's entirely possible there were no screws. With that said, I managed to find my filler(s)--there are three pieces on the Challenger--and there are definite screw holes with clear evidence they were used. Also, two of the three grilles I have here are drilled for the filler. One of those two definitely came from my car, since the third is still mounted in a spare header panel I bought several years ago.
Side note: When I found the bumper fillers, which I was sure I'd tossed because they're not going back--I found the black speaker grille material we'd discussed about 50 pages ago. Oy.
The reason I suggested pre-drilling and using self-drilling screws (which I could see being called "bit tip" since they look like a drill on the end) is because no matter the size of pilot hole, the tip will drill the pilot hole in the plastic to the appropriate diameter for the threads. Going by hand, you shouldn't have an issue with cracking. It's when you get impatient and grab the drill/screw gun that things start to disintegrate. Power tools aren't suitable for everything.
When you go to drill the holes, support the back side of the plastic with a piece of wood like a scrap of 1x1 or similar, just so you're not pushing directly against the plastic alone. It has very little structure or strength, so you want to spread that load against an easily-drilled backing. Gently C-clamp the wood to the grille, making sure there's no obstructions, braces, etc. in the way. Make sure it's perfectly flat to the grille. Use some paper towel between the C-clamp and the grille so you don't mar the finish.
I finally found a nearly-perfect button for the override switch and painted it red. I need to find a way to secure it but I think I've got that worked out. The housing is awaiting a final shot of paint--I didn't have what I wanted to use, but I'm liking the results anyhow--and then reassembly. The modifications are already done, and I'll ship it with the connectors on it with the wires in the places you need to duplicate. The factory red connector (which is black on your repro harness, but shouldn't be) has thus far resisted my attempts to renew it. Considering it's 50 years old and has been painted twice, it's not surprising. Your shiny new black one will work too; the only difference is the color.
The great thing about the way I modified the switch? Even if my modification lets go, which is very unlikely, it'll still work as-designed as an override switch... assuming all the other stuff (seat, belt, and door switches, module, etc.) are connected and working.
Side note: When I found the bumper fillers, which I was sure I'd tossed because they're not going back--I found the black speaker grille material we'd discussed about 50 pages ago. Oy.
The reason I suggested pre-drilling and using self-drilling screws (which I could see being called "bit tip" since they look like a drill on the end) is because no matter the size of pilot hole, the tip will drill the pilot hole in the plastic to the appropriate diameter for the threads. Going by hand, you shouldn't have an issue with cracking. It's when you get impatient and grab the drill/screw gun that things start to disintegrate. Power tools aren't suitable for everything.
When you go to drill the holes, support the back side of the plastic with a piece of wood like a scrap of 1x1 or similar, just so you're not pushing directly against the plastic alone. It has very little structure or strength, so you want to spread that load against an easily-drilled backing. Gently C-clamp the wood to the grille, making sure there's no obstructions, braces, etc. in the way. Make sure it's perfectly flat to the grille. Use some paper towel between the C-clamp and the grille so you don't mar the finish.
I finally found a nearly-perfect button for the override switch and painted it red. I need to find a way to secure it but I think I've got that worked out. The housing is awaiting a final shot of paint--I didn't have what I wanted to use, but I'm liking the results anyhow--and then reassembly. The modifications are already done, and I'll ship it with the connectors on it with the wires in the places you need to duplicate. The factory red connector (which is black on your repro harness, but shouldn't be) has thus far resisted my attempts to renew it. Considering it's 50 years old and has been painted twice, it's not surprising. Your shiny new black one will work too; the only difference is the color.
The great thing about the way I modified the switch? Even if my modification lets go, which is very unlikely, it'll still work as-designed as an override switch... assuming all the other stuff (seat, belt, and door switches, module, etc.) are connected and working.
RUSTY Cuda
In over my head!
Well we all wear seat belts here now, so if & that's a big if, everything in the system still works we should be good either way.
I should have some time to start setting up to do the filler, gonna tape it on first to see how bad the ends are warped maybe tape those down for a day or two to see if they will come back a bit?
I should have some time to start setting up to do the filler, gonna tape it on first to see how bad the ends are warped maybe tape those down for a day or two to see if they will come back a bit?
Dr.Jass
Pastor of Muppets
Those fillers are almost always warped. It's a miracle mine aren't, to be honest. Stretch had to find replacements for his, and it was a salt-free, cold-climate car so it most likely wasn't heat that warped his originals. Regardless, you might do well to steal Mrs. Rusty's hair dryer to warm them up and try to deform them back to shape. I was able to do that on a Rallye gauge bezel, another commonly-warped part.
On the subject of heat, don't attempt to drill that grille outside. Bring it in the house and let it sit for 12+ hours until the plastic is room temperature through-and-through. It's a lot more brittle at <50° than it is at 68°.
On the subject of heat, don't attempt to drill that grille outside. Bring it in the house and let it sit for 12+ hours until the plastic is room temperature through-and-through. It's a lot more brittle at <50° than it is at 68°.
RUSTY Cuda
In over my head!
Hmmmm, I did not plan on removing the grille if I can get to the 3 bottom supports that need to be drilled I would do it on the car.
I will study this mess close up tomorrow!
I will study this mess close up tomorrow!
Dr.Jass
Pastor of Muppets
After a lot of screwing around and elbow grease involving pointy objects, sandpaper, shop towels and Mother's wheel polish I actually got both override connectors in presentable shape. Considering multiple coats of paint and their age, they look surprisingly good. The white residue you see is wheel polish I didn't see. Flash photography is all to happy to point out what you missed.
This is what I pulled out of the car:
(Pay no mind to the wiring scheme; it's not right and won't work)
And here's what I'll be shipping to you (along with the switch, once it's done). Same parts. Pretty dramatic difference if you ask me.
Those are mega-up-close gynecological shots that highlight the remaining flaws. I don't think you'd find better unless you found NOS ones. That's possible for the brown connector (AuVeCo still sells those) but definitely not the red one.
I can't tell you how happy I'll be when this interconnect nonsense is over, i.e. when I ship this thing out. Between research, modification, refinishing, and restoration there's entirely too much effort into something that should've never been installed on any car in the first place. More than anything though I'm happy the switch was on my parts car and I'm able to do what was necessary. God forbid you had to buy one of these things; the prices are outrageous for such a dumb item.
Seriously, I use my disco-era Norelco "Gotcha Gun 1200" hair dryer more than I use my Milwaukee heat gun. That thing is like a famliy heirloom; it got both my sisters through high school in the big-hair 1980s. Mom used it too. It's got a lot of miles on it. It looks like this NOS one, only way more abused:
This is what I pulled out of the car:
(Pay no mind to the wiring scheme; it's not right and won't work)
And here's what I'll be shipping to you (along with the switch, once it's done). Same parts. Pretty dramatic difference if you ask me.
Those are mega-up-close gynecological shots that highlight the remaining flaws. I don't think you'd find better unless you found NOS ones. That's possible for the brown connector (AuVeCo still sells those) but definitely not the red one.
I can't tell you how happy I'll be when this interconnect nonsense is over, i.e. when I ship this thing out. Between research, modification, refinishing, and restoration there's entirely too much effort into something that should've never been installed on any car in the first place. More than anything though I'm happy the switch was on my parts car and I'm able to do what was necessary. God forbid you had to buy one of these things; the prices are outrageous for such a dumb item.
Then take the hair dryer out to your work area and warm it up in position. Just get it warm, not hot, and only heat a little spot at a time. Don't use a heat gun. It may be too much concentrated heat and warp or melt something. Hair dryers are easy to regulate, as evidenced by millions of women whose scalps aren't blistered because their hair caught fire.
Seriously, I use my disco-era Norelco "Gotcha Gun 1200" hair dryer more than I use my Milwaukee heat gun. That thing is like a famliy heirloom; it got both my sisters through high school in the big-hair 1980s. Mom used it too. It's got a lot of miles on it. It looks like this NOS one, only way more abused:
RUSTY Cuda
In over my head!
Those connectors look great, I feel bad this ordeal was so excruciating.
I hope some of the stuff I sent & will send in the not too distant future will ease the pain a bit!
I'm thinking spring time will be start up time, after I finish the front end I will jump back to the interior whenever the weather permits.
Really only need to set the distributor , fill up the fluids, put the new plugs & plug wires in & I think I'm ready to try turning the key???
then if that all works with no disasters I'll order the A/C kit.
I hope some of the stuff I sent & will send in the not too distant future will ease the pain a bit!
I'm thinking spring time will be start up time, after I finish the front end I will jump back to the interior whenever the weather permits.
Really only need to set the distributor , fill up the fluids, put the new plugs & plug wires in & I think I'm ready to try turning the key???
then if that all works with no disasters I'll order the A/C kit.