My 71 Duster work in progress

[b-body-bob]

I added that heat shield to the battery cables and put a small grant wheel back on it. The one that came with it had a rubberized grip that had a big split right in the top but I had another one with a hard plastic rim that I stuck on it. I even managed to fix the horn parts that time had destroyed (gorilla glue added) and got the horn button installed and working.

Unless something drastic happens I'm planning on adding fenders etc next.

 

[Dr.Jass]

I actually spliced the battery cable in the Valiant just because of that "heat formed" section. It passes through the header about perfectly and the only real issue was one of those crappy bolt-on cable ends. The copper was corroded around that, plus about 3-4" down inside the insulation. I bought a short cable, shortened it even more, and soldered/heat-shrunk it to the original cable. It's worked great thus far.

It's kind of weird the way a corroded cable that worked fine all at once went bad and shorted the whole car out, all from poking around with a shop vac. That'll teach me for trying to clean things up.

It was probably "right there" in terms of corrosion, and your poking around broke enough remaining copper to kill it entirely. That green cheese is fragile stuff.

 

[b-body-bob]

I thought I was putting fenders ON but it turned into putting them on and taking them off. I don't have the patience for this stuff. I'm having trouble getting it bolted to the splash shield and then aligning it on the car. I even looked at the body FSM, which basically said t remove it, take the bolts out, and to install it, put the bolts back in.

I tried bolting the splash shield to the fender, but couldn't get it lined up so am bolting it to the car then putting the fender over it. It's in the right place and all, but I'm having trouble getting the bolt to the wheel well lip started and the one at the top to the inside of the fender doesn't seem to line up with anything. I think the problem could be related to the new seals on the shield.

FWIW, factory fender, no shims, AMD fender, break out the whole box.

 

[b-body-bob]

Some googling leads me to believe that you can put the shields on a b-body after the fender is on the car. I didn't find a mention of a-bodies being the same, but I'm going to give it a try tonight anyway.

 

[Dr.Jass]

The splash shields were in place on my Valiant throughout the modification process, which means the fenders were removed and installed at least twice. Of course I know nothing of seals, new or otherwise. I literally didn't pay attention, but I had no problem getting everything installed. Of course, it's entirely possible that some hardware is missing, but we reinstalled everything that came off the car as far as we could tell.

Factory fenders, one crashed hard decades ago with approximately a 5-gallon bucket of filler in it, with a matching mangled inner and home-made flange patches where the inner fenders had rotted away... panel gaps like a Lexus. A post-apocalyptic, Mad Max sort of Lexus, but a Lexus nonetheless.

Cars are so much easier when "good enough" is better than it deserves.

 

[b-body-bob]

Good enough pretty much says it all with this thing.

I got the fenders on. Putting the splash shield in after the fender's hanging did the trick. I still had a little bit of a battle with the upper seal but I won that one.

As mentioned, the AMD fender isn't shaped exactly right, and it took a lot of shims to get it all aligned on that side, while the other side just bolted right on with a tight gap. As in almost too tight, but it won't move any more. I've got the opposite deal on the other side, it's all aligned with the door and cowl, but there's a big gap at the hood and it won't close up without going wacky at the door.

Who cares, I say. Not me, I answer myself.

Both doors open and shut, ditto the hood. That's about good enough.

The car's never been hit AFAICT.

 

[Dr.Jass]

The car's never been hit AFAICT.

Funny thing about that. I would've said the same thing about my Challenger when I bought it. Since I had to change the roof panel, I decided to have it placed on a frame rack and checked before proceeding. Sure enough, it had been hit hard at some point despite showing no obvious signs of such a crash. After it was pulled, it looked different. It did, but it didn't. I can't describe what it was, or why, but when I asked him @Stretch said he noticed it as well.

My fear was that some damage might become evident during the front-end alignment process, indicating it was out-of-square. Imagine if you will, your newly-completed, shiny black life's dream coming off the rack with a roof that oil-canned during the pull. I wasn't keen on changing the roof the first time; I sure as hell didn't want to do it twice.

 

[b-body-bob]

Here are some terrible photos


The fender shape doesn't match the door. I had to shim the bottom out 1/2" to get it that close. The top had to come up 1/4"




This side went back on nearly perfect with no shims.


Gap is too wide on this side, or maybe not wide enough on the other. Both look straight.



Next stop grille town.

 

[Dr.Jass]

One thing to remember about these cars, particularly the budget-minded A-bodies, is that they were never great in terms of fit and finish. Attempting perfection often results in considerable reworking of even OE panels. Mass production... it's a love/hate thing.

That being said, your passenger's-side hood gap looks a lot better to me than your driver's. The driver's is way too close. There's so much slop in the body panel mounting provisions on these cars that it's pretty easy to get things schmoozed around to where it looks reasonably good. There's not a single shim in the front sheetmetal on the Valiant, and the only really poor fitment is the front of the RH fender, which was obviously reused after the crash. To say we didn't even try would be overstating the effort we put into panel gaps. The leading edge around the grille has a droop or angle to it. The headlamp bezel fits fine but the line mismatch is pretty bad. As far as I'm concerned, on that particular car it adds character rather than being a flaw (have you seen the front bumper?! ).

The only visible part of the welded structure of the car forward of the windshield is the cowl. I'd shoot to get my gaps as good as possible there first (there's a ton of adjustment, a.k.a. slop, at the mounting stud in the rear corner of the engine bay). Generally, if you get that area right you'll usually be pretty close on the doors. Make sure the fender tops are close to parallel. Align the fender edges to the hood as much as possible once the latter is on and closed (you should have some adjustment in the hood latch area, too). The level of the hood is adjusted to match the fenders, not the other way around.

It's finicky work, but not really tedious (to me, anyhow). The fenders have a lot of give in terms of flex and twist so there's no literal "hard point" that absolutely defines where the other bolts will align. Push that shit around.

I'm really looking forward to seeing the installed grille, just to find out how well it works in the fastback body style. It's something I've not seen before. I expect the wiring is the same or very similar, but the '69 Valiant turn signals ground through a wire bolted to the upper core support. That's where I have the smaller wire on the battery (-) cable anchored. I had flaky turn signals/park lamps at first; the turn signals and hazards did a "lazy hyperflash" and the park lamps shut off when the headlamps were lit. Cleaning up the ground connections on the harness, including the ring terminal, fixed all those woes. Make sure those connections are very clean during assembly to avoid head-scratching secondary lighting woes later.

 

[69.5CUDA]

docs dead on about how much wiggle room you get with the a-body fenders and the how to align them..you HAVE to start at the cowl corners, F everything but aligning the cowl, and dont "lock" it down when youve got it..leave it "heavy snug" IE if you need to twist it will allow it

my 69 fish is bent, i personaly put it into a wall while hydroplaning slid sideways hit the wall spun 360, went from middle lane in the tunnel to comming out hitting the K-rail as neer dead square as you could and ending in the emergancy lane of the fast lane, the rails are straight thru the k member but the bumper section of the rails just cant be tweaked closer to OE short of "cut n paste" the inner fenders are just....OFF they were several inches of twist initialy but i managed to bend n force them back to the point of being something like 1/2 inch out of square, and ya know what..i managed to put the replacement fenders on WITHOUT shims and get everything lined up...dont ask me how that works but i atribute it to the flexability of the a-body fenders

 

[b-body-bob]

I had to open up the gap on the driver's side to get the front valance between the fenders. It's a balancing act trying to get it aligned with the door/cowl and have the right gap. I can move the fender out more, but that brings it out past the edge of the door. The fenders are also either a little too far back or forward (or maybe both since there's two sides to it) compared to the hood.

You better bet I was and am very careful shutting the hood to avoid whanging it down on the fender.

FWIW the first rule of fender club is don't tighten anything up yet. The second rule of fender club is don't tighten anything up yet.

I'm hoping the standard duster grille kit will work to attach the Valiant grille, because that's what I've got. I think that comes next, then the bumper. Then I might think about tightening everything up again.

 

[69.5CUDA]

get out the tape measure too, your likely having a weird angle issue

goto the corner of the fender at the driver door on the cowl top, measure across to the passenger front fender corner(tho my preferance is to goto the hood bumper bolt on the fender) now measure from the other side...thse number should be close..as close to dead nuts as possible, anything else will result in hood alignment issues, mind you..on shutting the hood you may have to further tweak it but it gets you in a much closer ballparkc


also throwing the lowwer valance in even loose as hell will help you get and keep everything square

 

[b-body-bob]

The duster grille hardware won't work. It sounds to me like I'll be repurposing hardware as needed. There is some good info here.

how do i install a 69 valiant grille in a 71 duster?

 

[Dr.Jass]

I was going to offer pictures if you needed any assistance with it. Seems like that thread kind of covers it, but as you may recall I do happen to have one 1969 Valiant with the correct grille installed in it.

 

[b-body-bob]

Seems like that thread kind of covers it, but as you may recall I do happen to have one 1969 Valiant with the correct grille installed in it.

I printed text and photos out of that thread to carry to the garage when I go. I was sure glad to find it.

also throwing the lowwer valance in even loose as hell will help you get and keep everything square

Right now it's all so loose that you can push on the driver's side and the passenger side will move.

Not really.

The passenger side is snugged up so I had one solid side to work from. Adding the valence did square things up. It was a real d'oh moment when I first held it in place and it was too long to fit between the fenders.

 

[b-body-bob]

BTW, Jass does your grille have a center emblem on it? Mine has places to mount one but no emblem. It seems that some came with and others without?

 

[69.5CUDA]

i spent most of HS with my head burried in the 69 plymouth FSM and had dug up option sheets for most cars its how i learned about the 69 1/2 cuda package as well as the valiant police cars and taxis...could you even imagine a valiant a high speed pursuit?!?!?!? dont get me wrong..the a bodys are nimble as hell in n out of the corners but heaven forbid they need to take a hit and the police package had f/r sways KH discs up front but a few options for rear axle..the 8.75 wasnt standard oddly enough...even tho the big drums were, while the taxi package was big drums all around with heavy springs and ZERO options...i recall even seeing a trunk mounted luggage rack at some point similar o whats seen on latter E-bodys

speaking to valiants and darts..its very common to have holes and no emblems in and outside the car, as there was a dozen different packages, from the full bare bones BELOW the taxi package all the way up to power everything and a few different trim options for all of them, which ment that a dealer with a strip down bare bones nothing could easily bolt on every last bell whistle and trim option

the ONLY 3 things that im aware of that would have required holes drilled was specific body trim levels, AC and the hood mount turn signals...everything else had the holes in place to just bolt/add on

and the hole enlargement for the AC blower motor is HUGE! and not easily drilled mostly cause its offset from the original heater hole.....

side note...a heater in a valiant was OPTION as a delete....ive seen a couple factory delete cars...and its strange to see, even spotted one once with factory radio and heater delete with the "gt" dash IE the barracuda dash, was a 4spd 273 HP car from hawiii i wanna say it was a 67

 

[Dr.Jass]

BTW, Jass does your grille have a center emblem on it? Mine has places to mount one but no emblem. It seems that some came with and others without?

Yes, my car has the center emblem, as does my spare grille. The grille I picked up for 71ChargerR/T does not, but that grille wasn't complete either (no turn signals, bezels, etc). According to the parts catalog, the center emblem was VH (Signet) only. It's a two-piece affair, with a spacer that fits behind the grille. The emblem part number was 2898239 and the backing spacer was 2898887.

There are two NOS grille emblems on eBay right now: one's in the US @ $175 and the one in Venezuela can be had for $140. The difference in price can be attributed to the high cost of transporting cocaine to the US, since both sellers clearly have a several-gram-per-day habit. It's a f__king 1969 Valiant emblem. NOS GTX emblems bring less; you couldn't even get a 4-barrel engine in a Valiant.

 

[b-body-bob]

From that threads I posted earlier

"the support on the driver side needs some massaging, and the bottom locating tabs need to be swapped over but you get the idea"

Actually, no I don't. I drilled out two rivets per the recommendations, because I can put those back if I have to, but swapping the bottom locating tabs means what? I don't even see how it's going to go in there unless I cut off a couple of mounting legs or put it in without the lower valence then put the lower valence which is both stupid and possibly impossible.

Also too, what's missing from this photo?



Probably I'm dumb, but there's not only no hood latch installed, there's not even a place for one to be mounted.

 

[Dr.Jass]

I wonder if he means the locating tabs need to be swapped over from the original grille. Looking at my grilles, including the one in the car, I have no idea what he could mean. He's not the most descriptive fella in the world, and his photos aren't very helpful. In fact, in the pictures the grille doesn't look to be installed properly. It seems to jut out toward the bottom near the center. In the original application, it most definitely has a slight forward lean:




Dude with no hood latch doesn't need one. He found a perfectly-horrible "Six Pack" hood which is probably pinned at all four corners. Call me a purist--there's a laugh--but to me Six Pack scoops do not look good on anything except 1969 B-bodies. It was not a particularly attractive scoop on its own. Regardless, his car seems to exhibit the same forward-thrusting lower center point as the orange car... which tells me they're doing it wrong.

I don't know if any of this will help, but here goes nothin'... maybe seeing the factory arrangement will help. These photos should enlarge if you click on 'em.

Hood latch support:




Detail of RH headlamp area, upper:




"Center" grille support, meaning the two closest to the center of the grille, this one being the RH side. The bolt is broken (there are lots of missing fasteners on my car) but it sits on a tab that's part of the lower filler panel:




Outer RH grille support "foot" (obscured by wire) near headlamp bezel, sitting atop another filler-panel tab--with another broken fastener:




Same support, this time as viewed from the side (camera was in the area of the hood latch support):




This is the bird's-eye view of the same area on the LH side, also with a broken bolt, taken without flash and with digital enhancement (brightness/contrast) in an effort to get some better detail:




Looking at the grilles that are not in a car, I honestly haven't a clue about swapping anything around. Both center "feet" are bent in the same direction, so it's not like they'd reverse anything if swapped. The outer brackets are defined by the headlamp, so there's no "swapping those over" either. Being that the Duster grille is plastic, I'd imagine that these parts, if they exist at all, would be dramatically different or molded into the grille itself.

The outer headlamp bezel screws, as I recall, simply thread into standoffs mounted to the fender.

I was going to attempt to make suggestions, but do you think I could find a picture of a '71 Duster grille filler panel? Of course not.