Enough with the 1974 Challengers!

[Dr.Jass]

I swear, they're all out to get me.

My project car is '74 (formerly L8 Dark Moonstone 318/auto)
My parts car is a '74 (E5 red 318/auto)
The doors and front clip on my '71 are from a '74 (also E5 red but a 360HP car, VIN sticker still on the door, trans unknown)

And last night, the sad remains of another one (a B1 blue 360HP/4-speed) followed me home:



It's fitting that it's upside-down, because this car was rolled to death around 1979/80. You're looking at the original home of the 360HP that I bought in mid-July. The core-support numbers match that block (dude still has the title, no less). I also have the cluster; she went on her head with only 18,000 miles on her. I actually have a bunch of parts from this car, and a friend grabbed the doors for one of his projects, dents and all.

Why bother, you ax? Well, for one thing it was free. One less thing on the property with which he has to deal made "get it out of here" payment enough. Being a Rallye, it had a couple of things worth saving. Y'see, the swaybar's still on it.




Not only is the swaybar there, so are the required lower control arms. Those three parts are connected with all the original 1974 hardware. When was the last time you saw 50-year-old swaybar link bushings that looked this good?





They're filthy, but they're not cracked or weatherbeaten. They were in the shade the whole time. The strut-rod bushings, along with the torsion bar and ball-joint boots look good.
Dig the rusted-out K-member (lower right corner of last image). Don't know that I've seen such damage in the past.

Since it was a Rallye, it had heavy-duty suspension. Those torsion bars are well worth knowin'.



The framerails are junk, but they're much better than what's on the other '74. No--not that one, the other one. No, that's a '71 with '74 parts; I mean the other other one. Sheesh.

I'm going to strip the good bits and offer the K to a friend that wants to build a run stand. If he doesn't want it, that and the rest of this tetanus festival is too rotten to be of any use. It'll get scrapped... a sad fate for a JH23J4B, but methinks the last of this chassis needs the closure.

 

[69.5CUDA]

the strut rod rubber was what caught my eye..shit looks NEW

but for being upside down...that rot is nuts...i can only assume it was filling with water in the winter and rusting out all summer...passenger rail looks good in the pics?

 

[restoman]

Being apart from the car makes those rails very repairable.
I'd stash them if you have room... ya just never know.

 

[Dr.Jass]

but for being upside down...that rot is nuts...i can only assume it was filling with water in the winter and rusting out all summer...passenger rail looks good in the pics?

I flipped it upside-down when I got it here to ease disassembly. It was sitting right-side-up for 40+ years, right on the ground.

Being apart from the car makes those rails very repairable.
I'd stash them if you have room... ya just never know.

I thought the same initially but they're really quite bad. I assure you, the camera adds 10lb. They're scrap.

 

[69.5CUDA]

the fact the k member is rotten says ALOT..but still that passenger rail looks solid in the shots..but i belive you its shot

 

[Dr.Jass]

Some further 1974 shenanigans.

Here's the decal on the '71's driver's-side door, which was originally Rallye Red:




Here's a color-enhanced version of the LH trunk floor of the Flying Jerry parts '74:

• The bright-orange, vivid-looking rust is the inside bottom of the frame rail.
• The red-highlighted spot is the coilover spring on the rear shock.
• The yellow-highlighted area is the leaf spring.
• Blue indicates the rearend axle tube.
• The lower shock plate is highlighted in green.

The U-bolt, brake line, and a twig can be seen crossing various components. This photo gives a better indication of the missing section of frame rail I posted here. The rubber plug to the right is a great point of reference.

 

[restoman]

Can you say "toast"?

 

[Dr.Jass]

Can you say "toast"?

I certainly can, but Kev insists it not be scrapped. "It's still an E-body." He's not wrong, but I doubt I'll ever attempt the work. Unlike him, I don't have a free spot in the woods where I can dump stuff indefinitely. I wonder how long he thinks I'll pay for storage on it.

 

[v8440]

Do you still have the black '74 challenger you got from me?

 

[Dr.Jass]

Uh, theoretically. It's been gone for body and paint for a long time. My bad for giving a generous downpayment on the work... why actually do it when you've already got thousands of dollars, right?

 

[Dr.Jass]

My project car is '74 (formerly L8 Dark Moonstone 318/auto)

This would be referring to the car you sold me. I'm sure it hadn't been ever been Dark Moonstone at any time during your affiliation with it. There were remnants of a tan or gold vinyl top, too. Gack... as if L8 weren't ugly enough on its own).

 

[v8440]

Ah, I either didn't know or didn't remember that. I hope the body shop doesn't completely rook you. Body shop purgatory is a real thing.

 

[restoman]

Uh, theoretically. It's been gone for body and paint for a long time. My bad for giving a generous downpayment on the work... why actually do it when you've already got thousands of dollars, right?

Uh oh.
As the former King of Taking on too Many Projects and Not Getting Them Done on Time, get after them.
I hated taking money up front. I've not seen any good ever come from it.

 

[Dr.Jass]

Yeah, I need to call him. The last time I heard from him was when he was trying to sell me on acid-dipping and EDP coating the whole car. I don't think he appreciated my initial outburst of laughter, or telling him that he'd never convince me it wasn't a waste of thousands of dollars. Clearly, he drank the Kool-Aid and swooned at its effects. The fact that even Kev now thinks it's a waste--and his is the rustiest car I've ever seen attempted personally--speakes tomes.

 

[Dr.Jass]

Meanwhile, back at the Chateaux...

Dismemberment was on the menu, specifically the remains of the rolled B1 E58/4-speed '74. I managed to successfully get everything I wanted without destroying anything (technically). It's rather easy to do when you bypass Miller Special Tools and use Milwaukee instead. And Metabo. And Makita.

This weekend's prime lesson: Never send a Sawzall to do the job of a 4½" angle grinder with a cutoff wheel.

I took the lower control arms, torsion bars, and LCA bushings/studs as complete assemblies. I also took the swaybar as an assembly, disconnecting only the nuts at the control arms and the brackets at the K-member.
"But Doc," you inquire, "It passes through the K-member. How'd you get it out of there without removing the links and bushings?"
I cut a strip out of the center of the K-member, that's how. The K itself wasn't worth saving because of rust and I'm a damned butcher. The less hardware I have to police and reinstall, the better. Then I saved the remains of the K-member anyhow, because who knows--someday maybe I'll want to build a run stand. It'll hold up to that.

The recovered parts, sans K and upper core support beam:




If you look closely, you'll see I chopped the section of frame out with the clutch countershaft bracket on it (sitting atop the swaybar) which I very-nearly forgot. I also kept the rear torsion-bar sockets, because one never knows. All the original hardware is in its original location, so when I get around to de-rusting this stuff I won't have to track down the wee bits.

Anyone need a '61 Dodge grille? I have two nice ones!

The newly-notched K after I'd absconded with all the treasure, hacked out the bottom of the core support for better access, and lopped off the back half of the subframe:




Better shots of the framerail carnage. First we have the seemingly-solid passenger's side:



(It's worth noting that the bumper-bolt fasteners had rusted out of the frame)

And here's the long-wasted driver's side:




I started a pile...




...and then I finished it!




And here's what's left of the K-member. I could only get three of the bolts out, and only one of those is actually useful--the other two are literally rotted away. The last bolt would not budge, so I carved out that section of frame to free the K. That last bolt is soaking in penetrant at the moment, but everything beyond the welded nut through which it passes is essentially gone. First time I've seen large hardware rot like that; it looks like a '76 Volare would've after its first winter.




I'm hoping to save the forward hardware on the strut rods, but the rods themselves are junk. I did manage to save the very-specific rear nuts, though, which were in surprisingly good condition.

So, I'm now back down to only two-and-a-half 1974 Challengers... although I did keep the upper core support rail as mentioned. It just seemed the right thing to do, since I have the numbers engine for it.

 

[restoman]

I owned a '76 Volare. Actually, it was a Road Runner.
Surprisingly, it was rust-free when I owned it in '82.
Really surprising, given that it was an east coast car.

 

[Dr.Jass]

I owned a '76 Volare. Actually, it was a Road Runner.
Surprisingly, it was rust-free when I owned it in '82.
Really surprising, given that it was an east coast car.

I briefly owned a '76 Volara with the ghastly landau roof when I lived in GA. It was sold new in Atlanta and spent its whole life there. It never saw salt and it was a rotten mess with both front frame rails on the verge of collapse. Even better, Chrysler forgot to install one of the weld nuts inside the frame for the K-member. The original owner, who sold me the car, said they noticed it at the first oil change. They went and got a new bolt, tried to install it, and there was nothing for it to grab. He just ran with it, driving the for almost 20 years that way until it got too rusty to drive.

I've always liked those cars other than the front suspension, but they were, generally speaking, a disaster overall in 1976-'77. Premature rust, recalls, the whole nine. I loved my '80 Aspen coupe regardless.

 

[restoman]

I briefly owned a '76 Volara with the ghastly landau roof when I lived in GA. It was sold new in Atlanta and spent its whole life there. It never saw salt and it was a rotten mess with both front frame rails on the verge of collapse. Even better, Chrysler forgot to install one of the weld nuts inside the frame for the K-member. The original owner, who sold me the car, said they noticed it at the first oil change. They went and got a new bolt, tried to install it, and there was nothing for it to grab. He just ran with it, driving the for almost 20 years that way until it got too rusty to drive.

I've always liked those cars other than the front suspension, but they were, generally speaking, a disaster overall in 1976-'77. Premature rust, recalls, the whole nine. I loved my '80 Aspen coupe regardless.

My '77 Aspen was a rotted mess when I got it for free in '87.
But it was a brown, four slant six car so it was ok. I did drive it for three years. Best car in snow I've ever seen.
When I still lived in Cape Breton, one of my buddies worked in the service dept of Cape Breton Chrysler.
He had access to all the warrantied front fenders from Volares & Aspens. I got them for free. Most were rusted out, but a few sets were spotless.
They were still sitting in Dad's lean-to when I left for Ontario..

 

[68R/T]

I briefly owned a '76 Volara ......

I've always liked those cars other than the front suspension, but they were, generally speaking, a disaster overall in 1976-'77. Premature rust, recalls, the whole nine. I loved my '80 Aspen coupe regardless.

My waGOON is a '76, and as far as I know has spent its' entire life in Wisconsin.

 

[Dr.Jass]

My waGOON is a '76, and as far as I know has spent its' entire life in Wisconsin.

That's a rarity. Generally speaking the wagons fare better than the sedans out back, but that's not the major problem area on most F-bodies. Most often, the front frame rails rust from the inside out, usually on the sides facing the transmission. It's easier to feel the damage than actually see it. The last time I saw my '80--about eight years after I sold it--it was getting pretty bad in that area.

Strangely, that problem doesn't seem nearly as significant on the J- and M-bodies, even in overlap years. My '81 LeBaron was solid as a rock in that area despite its living up here its whole life and documentation to the tune of over 350,000 miles on it. Obviously, it wasn't stored winters.