Early wake-up "call"

[Dr.Jass]

hell sound slike your sis has the plan made for you

Smart girl, your Sis.
That's what I'd be doing: waiting it out.
You're not out anything.

Amy's a very intelligent person. If she's interested in or involved with a subject, she will immerse herself in it. That includes her work, whatever job she may be doing. She's also quite pragmatic, so I listen to and heed her advice.
______________________

I have it on good authority that the fire was not directy caused by rodential intervention. Apparently the firefighters were "surprised by the number" of space heaters running in the house. The fire appears to have started on the north attic wall, a large section of which is now missing, right at the power drop. The attic vents were all chopped out to gain, uh, "ax-ess" for fire hoses. The house doesn't look that bad other than the soot above the former attic vent and the gaping maw on the north wall. The gas is shut off and locked, and the power drop is lying in the yard, disconnected at the pole. I'm told the fire did breach the roof but it was since tarped.

Now, I made this next observation prior to the fire: Most of the downstairs windows were, and currently remain, open. The kitchen window faces my house; I can't recall seeing it closed since his mother died. I noticed the other windows while walking my dog but never gave it much thought. I now assume that's how Junior was regulating the house temperature. He ran the heaters at WFO and opened windows to offset the heat. Never mind that temperature dial on the heater itself, Junior. Yes, he really is that stupid. Read on...

I talked to my other-side neighbor (Mark--he was named after a harelip dog) today, and apparently Junior was skulking around the remains of the house yesterday, idiotic game plan in hand. He said exactly what I predicted above about it not being that bad, by the way. He also said that he was running space heaters because the ignitor in his furnace was broken. Anyhow, here's his game plan: He'll "just put plywood over the roof vents and burned out spot" and his buddy is "gonna fix the wiring". That's his entire plan. He does not have a "buddy" that's a certified electrician; he doesn't run in such high social circles. This same "buddy" is not capable of changing the ignitor in a gas furnace, but can rewire a fire-destroyed power drop to the satisfaction of a power company inspector? On temporary plywood*, no less? I managed the former task never having looked in a gas furnace previously, but I wouldn't even consider attempting the latter. Nuh-uh... and in a long-ago life, I sold electrical supplies and knew all the electrical codes off the top of my head. Even if it all came back to me, I'd still call a pro. I doubt this buddy even knows what a weatherhead is. Not that there's any money for one... or wire... or plywood, for that matter. I have one American dollar that says he'll ask me if he can have the badly-weathered OSB (blandex) that's been leaning against my garage since, I dunno, 2010 or so. The visible side is flaking apart.

I told Mark the situation as explained by my sister, and that I'm sure the bills were also still in Motherfighter's name. Mark said he's almost positive Junior hasn't paid any of the property taxes, so those are probably already delinquent by almost a year. I said, "If it were me, I'd skate. If he has half a brain, he'll do exactly that. It wouldn't affect him in the least to do it. The place should've been condemned before they bought it. Now he's patching leaks on the Titanic." Mark thought about it for a minute and said, "Jeez. He'd be dumb not to walk away. But he is pretty dumb..." and went on to explain Junior's vehicle situation. That's a story unto itself, but it further illustrates the almost-terminal stupidity that governs his decisions.

So, stay tuned for our sure-to-be-short-lived miniseries, "Fire Recovery on Pennies and Favors" featuring Boo(zefighter) the Builder. Boo was incapable of blocking a square 4-inch hole in straight fascia but will somehow patch a 3-foot-wide hole in a gable end using nothing but plywood and curse words.

*By "temporary plywood" I mean "It'll stay that way until it falls off and he does the same thing." It will never be properly repaired.

 

[69.5CUDA]

.....oof

fwiw even with a will in many cases probate is still required..dealing with that shit still....

 

[b-body-bob]

FWIW the way property tax works here is you get one year to be delinquent. Then they sell your debt on the courthouse steps. If you want to keep the property, you pay the buyer back for the taxes plus interest. If you don't do that within a year, what is yours becomes the debt owner's and you get tossed out on your ear.

My Dad died with no property at all, but some money in the bank (he was a disabled Vet). All they really had to do was make sure he wasn't behind on taxes and file his final return. Even at that it cost us $3k to settle the estate.

 

[69.5CUDA]

thats about what its going to cost us..with property and an attorney running the show..2500ish is the attorney

 

[Dr.Jass]

FWIW the way property tax works here is you get one year to be delinquent. Then they sell your debt on the courthouse steps. If you want to keep the property, you pay the buyer back for the taxes plus interest. If you don't do that within a year, what is yours becomes the debt owner's and you get tossed out on your ear.

That's similar to what happens here in the case of an inhabitable/buildable property. They may attempt the same with Junior's property despite the inevitable condemnation, hoping a stupid buyer will come along. In that instance, the purchaser has a given amount of time to repair or clear the property, usually 180 days, before the fines start accumulating along with the property tax burden you've assumed.

The problem for any buyer is the value of the lot itself. Let's assume Junior's taxes are $1,000 and the property sells for that. Atop your investment, you now have to spend thousands to have the house wrecked and removed. A friend who works for the neighboring city's DPW said the last demo of which he's aware cost over $7,000 a few years ago. Using that number a buyer has eight grand invested. A buildable lot in this neighborhood is worth maybe five to seven grand. At the end, they're at least $1,000 upside down, probably more. That lot is simply not a good investment.

Let's get to the Bonus Round: I'm almost positive that house will require professional asbestos removal. I remember Levi & Eric (the previous tenants) mentioning it more than once. Cha-ching. There is also black mold in the house per Brucefighter, Junior, the opposite-side neighbors, etc. It's been there a long time (Bruce died several years ago). Those are burdens I'd rather leave to the county, personally.

The black mold and fire damage should be enough to get the house condemned assuming anyone bothers to look at it. If that happens, since Junior's not the owner, the grace period would expire and the city would take possession before he was able to wrangle his way through the probate process. He can't address condemnation as a tenant. However, the law does says his landlord (mother) must provide him with safe, adequate accomodations until repairs are effected.

Realistically, the worst-case scenario (other than Junior's staying) is that I don't get the property and it goes to some contractor with a clever architect. A new house gets erected and sold. It's possible I'd get another total f__kbag loser neighbor in the process, but the odds are certainly against it. I don't see it being repaired or rebuilt, though.

 

[b-body-bob]

Realistically, the worst-case scenario (other than Junior's staying) is that I don't get the property and it goes to some contractor with a clever architect. A new house gets erected and sold.

In this hood a contractor would be all over it and have about 4 apartments on a house-sized lot quicker than you can say dirty-lousy-contractor-scumbag.

 

[69.5CUDA]

In this hood a contractor would be all over it and have about 4 apartments on a house-sized lot quicker than you can say dirty-lousy-contractor-scumbag.

yup same here, or youd end up with these tiny tall condoish style homes which may as well be apartments,

the place would be demoed, built and up for sale in under 2 months start to finish

 

[Dr.Jass]

In this hood a contractor would be all over it and have about 4 apartments on a house-sized lot quicker than you can say dirty-lousy-contractor-scumbag.

Luckily, this area is zoned for a maximum 2-family dwelling. The lot isn't big enough for a duplex regardless, but the parking issue would seal it. There must be off-street parking so snowplows can operate. Once again, though, the neighborhood dictates the market. Invest $100K putting a house there, and you'll have a brand-new $65K house. We've no shortage of solid, more-suitable vacant lots around here for those types.

I literally just talked to Junior, and according to him the Red Cross is going to fix him right up: "They're going to get contractors out here for the repairs and the electrical." I doubt he told them he is not the legal owner of the house. I also doubt any contractor worth his salt will want to get involved, but I would hope the Red Cross would at least send a building or health inspector. I'd expect they'll at least verify ownership.

This is what he's up against. Click on the picture to enlarge it.



To the right in the photo is the garage. It was 100% unaffected by the fire. The windows have been boarded up for years and Junior wouldn't put anything of value in it that could be damaged by a roof collapse or water damage, nor would his mother before him. You can see the power drop lying on the garage, and the hole to which it leads. Immediately to the right of that dormer is another hole through which you could chuck a rhino, assuming you could in fact chuck one. The fire also burned through the peak vent, which is visible here too. If you follow the power drop, you'll see the sheer goatf__kery that is the meter connection, tucked in the corner behind the laundry pole. Butchery like that will not fly these days. Also, note the open window. At the extreme left, you can just make out where the fascia stops at the squirrel entrance. That addition's left wall has water running--sheeting, in fact--down the inside of it during rainstorms due to roof rot. I was shown that issue (feature?) by the previous tenants. In 2003.

The shrub in the foreground is mine, which gives you an idea of the proximity to the property line. The front of the garage is about 6' from the sidewalk, which also won't fly under modern zoning. End to end, the side shown is about 24' not including the out-of-shot garage protrusion. That entire left structure (with the roof rot) could not be rebuilt, along with another 1-2 feet to the right of it. The chimney is about a foot inside zoning distance.

 

[69.5CUDA]

funny thing about zoning in regards to "repairs and remodels" in most cases...so long as you dont disturbe the fondation you can continue to have said wall over the "new" zone line as its "grandfatehred" where it currently is..funny enough most states have a real quirky code when it comes to remodels and repairs that allows you to get away with weird shit...like the whole "if you leave up 1 wall you can flatten the rest of the building and still call it a remodel" which then changes how the rules and costs apply to you

remodels were typicaly our bread n butter for nearly 20 years before i was able to GTFO.....

as far as redcross is concerned..they typicaly have ppl and teams who will come out and do these kind of repairs and they also tend to not ask a whole lot of questions...tho they ALWAYS do a FULL building inspection to see what else that they can "help you with"..ive seen them re-roof entire houses, swap out every window and insulate an entire house just to help out.....so he might just win the lottery on that especialy being its winter

 

[thrashingcows]

.....oof

fwiw even with a will in many cases probate is still required..dealing with that shit still....

Man do I know that...2 years on and still dealing with my mom's estate...mostly thanks to her decision to put my brother and I as co-executors and my lying, lazy, ignorant brother. FYI if you have any kids DO NOT put them on as joint executors....choose one for good or ill.

 

[b-body-bob]

Luckily, this area is zoned for a maximum 2-family dwelling. The lot isn't big enough for a duplex regardless, but the parking issue would seal it. There must be off-street parking so snowplows can operate. Once again, though, the neighborhood dictates the market. Invest $100K putting a house there, and you'll have a brand-new $65K house. We've no shortage of solid, more-suitable vacant lots around here for those types.

I literally just talked to Junior, and according to him the Red Cross is going to fix him right up: "They're going to get contractors out here for the repairs and the electrical." I doubt he told them he is not the legal owner of the house. I also doubt any contractor worth his salt will want to get involved, but I would hope the Red Cross would at least send a building or health inspector. I'd expect they'll at least verify ownership.

This is what he's up against. Click on the picture to enlarge it.

View attachment 24547

To the right in the photo is the garage. It was 100% unaffected by the fire. The windows have been boarded up for years and Junior wouldn't put anything of value in it that could be damaged by a roof collapse or water damage, nor would his mother before him. You can see the power drop lying on the garage, and the hole to which it leads. Immediately to the right of that dormer is another hole through which you could chuck a rhino, assuming you could in fact chuck one. The fire also burned through the peak vent, which is visible here too. If you follow the power drop, you'll see the sheer goatf__kery that is the meter connection, tucked in the corner behind the laundry pole. Butchery like that will not fly these days. Also, note the open window. At the extreme left, you can just make out where the fascia stops at the squirrel entrance. That addition's left wall has water running--sheeting, in fact--down the inside of it during rainstorms due to roof rot. I was shown that issue (feature?) by the previous tenants. In 2003.

The shrub in the foreground is mine, which gives you an idea of the proximity to the property line. The front of the garage is about 6' from the sidewalk, which also won't fly under modern zoning. End to end, the side shown is about 24' not including the out-of-shot garage protrusion. That entire left structure (with the roof rot) could not be rebuilt, along with another 1-2 feet to the right of it. The chimney is about a foot inside zoning distance.

The best thing that could happen to that place is a knock down. Call it the boozefighter memorial park and put up a swingset and a sand box.

I see that at least he only drinks "BEST" beer. IME something named like that means that is is not.

 

[Dr.Jass]

funny thing about zoning in regards to "repairs and remodels" in most cases...so long as you dont disturbe the fondation you can continue to have said wall over the "new" zone line as its "grandfatehred" where it currently is.

Not the case here. The only way you can grandfather is to leave the offending wall, complete and original, in place. The second that wall moves, falls down, or starts being modified, you're out. This happened to a friend who'd started building a larger garage in the same spot as the old one. Once he was down to a frame, they said the wall no longer grandfathered. He ended up with a 1.5-car where there used to be a 2-car.

As I recall, the foundation isn't particularly great either. That's another thing I'd heard from the previous tentants. Part of it is block (visible in the photo) and the rest is, I believe, fieldstone. However, it does look OK from the outside as I recall.

as far as redcross is concerned..they typicaly have ppl and teams who will come out and do these kind of repairs and they also tend to not ask a whole lot of questions...tho they ALWAYS do a FULL building inspection to see what else that they can "help you with"..ive seen them re-roof entire houses, swap out every window and insulate an entire house just to help out.....so he might just win the lottery on that especialy being its winter

Once again, it's possible. I have a hard time believing the Red Cross would do $30+K worth of work, but wouldn't bother to ask who owns it, whether the taxes are in good standing or it's teetering on foreclosure, or whether it's even worth doing. Once again, this isn't simply fire damage to a solid structure. It's fire damage to a structure that was condemnation-ready 20 years ago. It's a rotting, moldy, century-plus-old corpse of a house.

Man do I know that...2 years on and still dealing with my mom's estate...mostly thanks to her decision to put my brother and I as co-executors and my lying, lazy, ignorant brother. FYI if you have any kids DO NOT put them on as joint executors....choose one for good or ill.

My eldest brother was Mom's executor. The will stated flat-out, "There will be no arguing. If two siblings do not agree on disposition of an item, the other two will decide it." Of course, that leaves potential for another deadlock, but it didn't come to pass. The only argument lasted less than 20 seconds, and it was over my Dad's dog tags. My brother grabbed them, and I said I'd like one of them. He very-sharply said, "Were you in the Army?!" to which I shot back, "I wasn't in the Marine Corps and neither were you. We were both his sons, though." David thought for a second then gave me one of the tags. He later apologized.

The best thing that could happen to that place is a knock down. Call it the boozefighter memorial park and put up a swingset and a sand box.

I see that at least he only drinks "BEST" beer. IME something named like that means that is is not.

I dunno, I see it as a fenced-in yard for the neighboring house...

You would not believe the amount of cheap beer that family could put away. Stretch and I watched them unload at least 12 cases of beer from a friend's trunk one morning. Later that day they did another beer run in the afternoon, gathering up a similar number of cases. There were exactly five people drinking: Sugar (Motherfighter), Boots (Brucefighter), Cookie (their sister), Junior, and Cousin It (Cookie's bull-dyke daughter that thinks she's a boy). That's 57 beers per person in less than 12 hours. In the absolute depths of my alcoholic depravity, I never approached that rate. With these lunatics, it wasn't all that uncommon.

 

[restoman]

Up in these parts, reno-rebuild work on older buildings simply needs a visit to the municipal planning department to verify the age of the existing structure. If it's deemed to be built somewhere around 25+ years ago, and there are no code violation notices attached to the property, it's deemed "legal non-conforming".
A survey is then required to determine the extent of non-compliance, and if all goes well, reno/rebuilding can commence, providing the reno/rebuild work stays exactly within the surveyed footprint. Of course, all pertinent building codes have to be adhered to in any and all new construction or tear-outs.
The lone exception is if a building is to be completely demolished. Technically, it can be rebuilt according to the above dictates, but the rub is that the demo work NEEDS to include foundation removeable. Once the foundation is removed, it's considered a new construction site, and all municipal and provincial regs apply.

I sorted this in hopes of lifting my garage off its dirt floor, pouring a cement floor and lowering it back down. Since the garage never had a floor or foundation, it's considered non-permanent. But, a survey and planning department records show it as legal non-conforming, built before 1975, so doing what I plan to do is all good. If someone from the building dept. had ever noted the dirt floor, I'd have to follow new construction regs.

I'm pretty sure Red Cross will want to do a thorough walk-through inspection before tackling any work. Foundation structural solidity will likely be a must before they take on the work. And they will check ownership, as many times, there are strings attached to ensure the home isn't sold or transferred once it's brought up to code. Sometimes, they will want repayment if the property is sold or transferred within a certain time period. Charitable work is fantastic, but they have to ensure the charity isn't mis-used...

 

[Stretch]

Sounds like someone needs to let the county, city, know about the ownership status.

Letting the RedCross know might result in them "helping" by taking care of the legal ownership issues.

 

[69.5CUDA]

Sounds like someone needs to let the county, city, know about the ownership status.

Letting the RedCross know might result in them "helping" by taking care of the legal ownership issues.

hmm your not wrong

 

[Dr.Jass]

The Red Cross doesn't do that. It's not a question of whether there are extenuating circumstances, they simply don't do legal work, period. There is no "they might, if..." because they won't. The Red Cross' mission is disaster relief, not helping lazy people sort out their legal issues. They are not going to swoop in and save Junior's day. At best, they will provide him a place to live for a finite time during which he's expected to acquire new housing, or repair the old.

I talked at length with a friend who's heavily involved with the city. The house absolutely will be condemned, without question. It's just a matter of when. Once that's done, the owner has 90 days to bring it within code--not simply to its pre-fire condition, but fully compliant--before they will lift the condemnation and declare it habitable. If measurable, code-compliant progress can be shown to the building inspector in a reasonable time, the owner may be able to get an extension to complete the work. At least three professionals need to certify the work: A master plumber, a master electrician, and a licensed, bonded contractor. Only after the work's cleared can the utilities be restored. Next, the building inspector comes back along with the health inspector, to officially declare it habitable. If all that hasn't happened by the deadline, the property is forfeited. The city will not grant a second extension.

Junior, as I've mentioned repeatedly, is not the owner. He has no avenue to contest or reverse the condemnation. Even if tens of thousand of dollars fell into his lap tomorrow and he managed to get that deathtrap code-worthy in time, he's not his mother. It would take an act of God to get the probate cleared in that time.

Nevertheless, there's a ladder against the house and a cute little 15"x15" square patch of thin OSB screwed over part of the hole in the peak where the drop burned through. Bless his retarded little heart, he's trying.

 

[74DartSport]

<popcorn >

 

[dodgechargerfan]

 

[b-body-bob]

 

[Dr.Jass]

They've done their bit and have apparently removed themselves from further involvement. They provided him with rent money and $500 specifically to fix the furnace. He drank and smoked all that money and continues couch-bombing with friends. Why the hell they would provide cash is beyond me. Apparently his unemployment got renewed after 1 January, so why work?

Coincidentally, as Stretch & pulled up to my house last night after work, the DPW was there turning off the water--7 weeks after the fire. So, the faucets have been open for six of those, albeit likely long-frozen. Anyhow, the city truck prompted the other-side neighbors to initiate another conversation. It started with the fact that Junior had apparently been there 15-20 prior to the city's arrival. Highlights include:

• Larry's mother had shingles put on several years ago (she did not "have the roof done" because no rot was replaced; the roof leaked during the next rainstorm). The shingle-berry said the structure beneath was bad. He also told her she'd better address the electrical because she was overdue for a house fire.
• Motherfighter did go to an attorney to have the house put in Junior's name. Apparently she never paid him, or there was another visit required, because it does not appear to have happened.
• "I'm not letting go of that house. It's paid for." - Junior
• "All I have to do is block off that one bedroom and I can move back in. I already fixed the wall and the roof." - Junior, referencing the small OSB patch on the torched gable end and the large blue tarp over the 3'-diameter canyon among shingles
• "Do what you want, I'm not moving back into that shit hole." - Junior's son, who has since found his own place
• "My buddy's an electrical contractor. He's gonna fix the wiring for free." - Junior, who probably doesn't realize his chum is, in fact, a businessman. While he may provide some free labor on the side, he ain't buying wiring and service panels (it should be noted this is a different buddy that the one mentioned previously)
• "As soon as I move back in, I'm getting insurance on it so I don't get stuck like this again." - Junior, delusionally believing there's some company out there that would insure that dumpster

So not unexpectedly, he's still scheming to stay there and either doesn't know, can't comprehend, or is in complete denial of the odds against him.